+1, or picking apart more bad arguments (Gaming)
I wish Infinite's use of the Vox uprising was more like that than what we got. Again, I refer us back to Booker's line in the elevator where we get hit over the head with it Master Chief Halo 4 style. AM I A MACHINE/THE VOX ARE BAD.
I totally get what you're saying about subtlety, and I'm on record for hating that line in Halo 4, and that's because it connects dots no one needs help connecting.We're getting into sensitive territory here, but it seems that many of BioShock Infinite's critics wanted it to be a different story than it is--specifically, they wanted a morality tale about racism (the evils of white racists in particular). They wanted the dots to be connected in a very specific way. I submit that what makes the game edgy is that racism is presented as something more complicated, as something like a disease that can be spread to its victims. The danger of this presentation is that it runs the risk of removing moral judgment. Booker speaking out is a counter to that.
I'm not saying Levine was 100% successful in what he was trying to do, but racism--its sources and effects--is presented, thoughtfully and with nuance. Much more so than that Daniel Golding article suggests.
I have more to say, of course, but I haven't had dinner yet. :)
Precisely. I do think the issue of when are you being obtuse versus being over the top is a fine one--as we're citing, the Master Chief line is a perfect example of something that just wasn't necessary and cutting would have made a strong scene much stronger. But that's a matter of presentation, not the core thrust.
This critique is the poster-child for missing the point: http://superopinionated.com/2013/04/03/booker-dewitt-and-the-case-of-the-young-white-lady-feels-a-bioshock-infinite-r...
Ken Levine didn't set out to make a game about the Occupy movement and racism. He set out to tell a fantastic tale of multiverses coming together and unraveling against a rich history-inspired backdrop that, unsurprisingly enough, was very racist. Those are the terms you have to judge the game on first. While I love the "what if they had focused on this" game too, it's ignoring the fact that something can't be everything to everyone. It's like complaining that Citizen Kane was a really bad screwball comedy. It wasn't trying to be. If you can't see that, it's a failure of the viewer, not the work itself.
Complete thread:
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Jillybean,
2013-08-06, 13:02
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-06, 16:16
- I'm a time travel junkie - Xenos, 2013-08-06, 16:30
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* - kanbo, 2013-08-06, 17:54
- The storytelling was somewhat jumbled. - uberfoop, 2013-08-06, 19:42
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
yakaman,
2013-08-07, 04:35
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 07:40
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* - SonofMacPhisto, 2013-08-07, 07:46
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 07:40
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-07, 07:53
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 08:12
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-07, 09:10
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
Kermit,
2013-08-07, 09:19
- I liked the gameplay subthread - SonofMacPhisto, 2013-08-07, 09:56
- I liked the gameplay subthread - Jillybean, 2013-08-07, 11:28
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
Kermit,
2013-08-07, 09:19
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-07, 09:10
- I liked the gameplay subthread -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 08:12
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Cody Miller,
2013-08-07, 11:18
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* - Jillybean, 2013-08-07, 11:28
- scavenging -
kidtsunami,
2013-08-07, 13:05
- scavenging -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 13:13
- scavenging -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-07, 13:19
- actually no - kidtsunami, 2013-08-07, 13:48
- scavenging -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-07, 13:19
- scavenging -
Jillybean,
2013-08-07, 13:13
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Schooly D,
2013-08-07, 13:58
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* - Cody Miller, 2013-08-07, 14:14
- I can leave you two alone if it helps. - Jillybean, 2013-08-07, 14:29
- I wonder - ZackDark, 2013-08-07, 17:39
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Chewbaccawakka,
2013-08-09, 10:51
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Jillybean,
2013-08-09, 10:59
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Chewbaccawakka,
2013-08-09, 12:57
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Jillybean,
2013-08-09, 13:29
- Super run-on sentences FTW. - Chewbaccawakka, 2013-08-09, 13:55
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Jillybean,
2013-08-09, 13:29
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Chewbaccawakka,
2013-08-09, 12:57
- Super run-on sentences FTW. -
Jillybean,
2013-08-09, 10:59
- Bioshock makes me appreciate Halo more -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-12, 19:59
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-12, 20:04
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
Jillybean,
2013-08-13, 12:57
- My view on the racism part *spoiler* - Xenos, 2013-08-13, 13:13
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
Kermit,
2013-08-13, 14:20
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
Jillybean,
2013-08-13, 14:47
- ...also to add to the racism thing - Kermit, 2013-08-13, 15:10
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
Jillybean,
2013-08-13, 14:47
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-13, 16:06
- One little tweak... -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-13, 17:16
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-13, 19:45
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-13, 20:38
- One little tweak... -
Jillybean,
2013-08-14, 11:03
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-14, 12:25
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-14, 14:53
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-14, 17:34
- Agreed. - Xenos, 2013-08-14, 17:51
- +1, or picking apart more bad arguments -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-14, 19:57
- Bad article is bad. *SP* -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-14, 21:48
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
Xenos,
2013-08-14, 22:31
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-15, 04:50
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
MrPadraig08,
2013-08-15, 08:56
- Hitler trivia time! - davidfuchs, 2013-08-15, 10:06
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
Jillybean,
2013-08-15, 11:59
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
Xenos,
2013-08-15, 12:16
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
MrPadraig08,
2013-08-15, 13:02
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... - Xenos, 2013-08-15, 13:04
- You try to get out... -
Jillybean,
2013-08-15, 13:04
- ...and I keep pulling you back in. -
Xenos,
2013-08-15, 13:10
- You try to get out... - davidfuchs, 2013-08-15, 13:21
- ...and I keep pulling you back in. - MrPadraig08, 2013-08-15, 13:51
- ...and I keep pulling you back in. -
Xenos,
2013-08-15, 13:10
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
MrPadraig08,
2013-08-15, 13:02
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... - Cody Miller, 2013-08-15, 14:34
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
Xenos,
2013-08-15, 12:16
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... - Cody Miller, 2013-08-15, 14:30
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
MrPadraig08,
2013-08-15, 08:56
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... - SonofMacPhisto, 2013-08-15, 15:01
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-15, 04:50
- Man, our culture doesn't get racism... -
Xenos,
2013-08-14, 22:31
- I still disagree -
Jillybean,
2013-08-15, 11:57
- I still disagree -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-15, 13:02
- Here's a thought... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-16, 10:48
- Here's a thought... - Kermit, 2013-08-16, 11:47
- Here's a thought... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-16, 10:48
- I still disagree - Cody Miller, 2013-08-15, 14:22
- I still disagree -
Kermit,
2013-08-16, 21:19
- I still disagree -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-17, 06:23
- I still disagree -
Kermit,
2013-08-17, 11:10
- I still disagree - SonofMacPhisto, 2013-08-17, 11:45
- I still disagree -
Kermit,
2013-08-17, 11:10
- I still disagree -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-17, 06:23
- I still disagree -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-15, 13:02
- Bad article is bad. *SP* -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-14, 21:48
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-15, 15:00
- One little tweak... - Kermit, 2013-08-16, 07:45
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-14, 17:34
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-14, 14:53
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-14, 12:25
- One little tweak... -
Jillybean,
2013-08-14, 11:03
- One little tweak... -
Kermit,
2013-08-13, 20:38
- One little tweak... -
SonofMacPhisto,
2013-08-13, 19:45
- One little tweak... -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-13, 17:16
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
Jillybean,
2013-08-13, 12:57
- ...also to add to the racism thing -
davidfuchs,
2013-08-12, 20:04
- Let's talk about Bioshock Infinite *long and spoilery baby* -
Ragashingo,
2013-08-06, 16:16