Luke On Sunsetting (Destiny)

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Thursday, December 17, 2020, 22:50 (1443 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Which is EXACTLY WHY I made that distinction of "IN THE GAME". Organization works best as you get it. I should not have to use third party stuff to play the game. That is a failure of core maniacs for, as I say it again, the game with a core mechanic of "loot". I know in the moment why I put something away, and shouldn't have to jump around different screens to do what I need to do. It should not feel like work. The best way to do that is in game.

I am honestly curious about what this means to you. What is it that you want to do IN GAME that you can't? (I'm not looking for "organize my stuff" - I'm looking for what you think would help the average Destiny player not simply vault gear they don't have time to test, if your thoughts could be turned into actual programming.) How are you envisioning using an Xbox controller to organize (i.e. compare and winnow) your gear?

Again: I'm not looking for vague "I want to do this" - you clearly think that this is a thing you should be able to do, in-game. I'm not asking you to program it - I'm asking you what it would look like. I, personally, cannot envision ANY system that I could manage with a controller that would make me happy. You clearly have other ideas, and I would love to hear them.

To do such justice would require time to create a proper mock up, much like was seen for the Ghost UI we have now (which as I recall was a suggestion posted from the Destiny subreddit). TL;DR maybe after 2020. Maybe. That said, I can speak of both one small remedy I currently use (that's mildly expensive to do), an observation, and a complement.

• If I want to remember that "X" weapon is best within PvE or PvP, for whatever it is, I'll masterwork it up to the point where I get the enemy counter. I'll then label it PvP or PvE.
  
• What buttons do you use and don't you use when looking at the gun menu? How about the screen real estate?
  
• Within the game, one of the best UI upgrades Bungie has done is the tool tip that you can get if you hover over a weapon or armor which expands out over when you press the trigger in the character menu.

If you disagree with that, than please bring better ideas. This may help, here is a question I've not seen asked (and even alluded to in my post); do exotic weapons suffer from the same issue? Why or why not?

I told you my 'better idea' - it's to use a mouse and keyboard, and an interface built for them, to do the organizing. It works really well for me. It isn't in-game, and in fact (the way I want it to work) cannot be - and I'm okay with that.

No Wu, that's not an idea. That's status quo. While it is fine that you enjoy it, it also means little to what I ask. Feels like a dodge to me. You could have said nothing on this point, and it would be the same result.

I have absolutely no idea what you're asking with regard to exotics. Can you rephrase your question?

I'd like to clarify my original question instead, hopefully you don't mind.

The original question I asked was; do exotic weapons suffer from the same issue? Why or why not? The context of "the same issue" being about organization through the game interface. To further clarify; "organization" ultimately means in this case "What in this gun makes it worth using over something else?"

Does that help?

(Yes, I know there are far fewer exotics. Duh.)

(Also, your flippant "solution" to the Mountaintop-type problem makes me roll my eyes harder than anything Luke Smith has EVER said. But maybe that's just me.)

Sorry you found what would work to be flippant and worthy of rolling your eyes. What do you see that challenges the effectiveness? Is it not why at minimum Bungie goes and disables things when there is an issue? It WORKS! There would be less issue then sunsettings continual muck. Yes, some folks would be peeved on all the effort made towards the weapon would suddenly be for not, as we've seen with sunsetting ad nauseam, hence the "bright dust" or something to that effect.

You think taking something that many, many people love and simply deleting it 'works'?

That doesn't work. That's the lazy, zero-effort way out of this problem, and it introduces a whole host of new problems that are arguably worse than leaving it completely alone. "Some folks would be peeved" - heh.

I honesty pulled a double take reading this. What a topsy turvy answer.

Topics can get lost in the quote stack, so to reiterate; this part here involves "the Mountaintop-type problem" which I mention in my root post. I do so as a part of my thoughts in how having far better in-game tools to organize our kit would be preferable to sunsetting. Something that would give us a more "play-your-way" agency thing. If I knew I hadn't touched a weapon in two years... I might want to shard it. Things like that, with other examples among my posts here. Yet with this conceptual scenario I presented, folks will still keep the broken/erroneously designed weapons which through the sunsetting mechanic will eventually make whatever it is irreverent. Kit that is so broken, so conceptually overbearing, that to not use it is to lose. Recluse in its original form is also a good example.

That means we all suffer while it gets fixed, or you are forced to use it to fight back. The problem is, first impressions. Once you nerf it to "fix it" to be what it should have been, well... how do I put this? Um... a meat eater who switches to vegan never forgets the savory memories. Does that metaphor make sense? The weapon feels half its former self (the vegan metaphor is over folks... please don't infer), as you'll never forget how fun it was to use at one point while it was overpowered and essential to use. I think that a fair inference so far, yes?

In that case where you have a weapon that has proved to be a problem child that breaks the games established power dynamic... get rid of it. It's what sunsetting is doing anyway, but in my scenario its more a controlled demolition instead of a indiscriminate bloodbath. And while yes, we could go down the rabbit hole and peck at this more, that's what this is about per the original root post. A response to my "what if".

Now then...

If I have read your response correctly Wu, and I might not have as it is admittedly late as I write this, you find this solution I proposed to not be one. Quite the opposite in fact. On top of that, you find this idea within my concept lazy. If I inferred your response to the trolley problem, you'd rather run over all five of those poor folks on the rack, instead of just one. Shoot! Lets back up and get the other guy too! You are defending sunsetting upon this case after all. Thus, "little sally" gets run over too - YOU MONSTER. Also - side note, that would be an AWESOME gun name. lol.

You can clam all you like that it would not work, but you have not proven your point in this concept. In fact, you've provided nothing on how this would be so. How would removing "X" that is causing the problem in the game not work? As I state in the quote above, Bungie doesn't seem to have an issue with it when they do this half way and disable things, though I suppose bringing this as an example might not be fair to the concept, as those trended to be exotics, not legendaries with exotic perks on them.

Everything else you said is irreverent. This is about conceptual results, not feelings. If the end result is a better gameplay experience, I myself don't care how much effort was needed to make it. And infact developer wise; lazy, quick, and good results would be a complement, but I'm starting to digress so I'll end this here.