Indie Game Exam Question 3 (FINAL)

This last question is a long form essay. No minimum length as long as you make your points convincingly.

Why is the notion of 'indie' a myth? What makes this distinction for video games non sensical? How does this contribute to the decline in the way we talk and think about video games as an art form?

First essay to get an A (if any do) wins a $20 steam card. Enough to buy like 3 indie games! :-p

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I disagree that it is a myth since 'indie' is shorthand for 'independent', which means they're not funded by people not directly related to the development. Now, many, many games still are done exactly like that. Sure, not even 5% of them get know by even 1% of people around the internet, but it still happens, and as such, 'indie' is not a myth.

Now, if you want us to say 'indie' is a myth, you have to be a little more specific on which facet of the term 'indie' you're trying to bust.

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I disagree that it is a myth since 'indie' is shorthand for 'independent', which means they're not funded by people not directly related to the development.

So your definition of 'indie' is that it's an indie game when the game development team PAYS to work on the game, instead of getting paid?

That means none of the indie games funded through kickstarter are indie then, because folks kicking in aren;t directly related to the development.

I don't like your definition.

Hint: What is independence? Is ANY game developer truly independent?

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True, Kickstarter kindda unbalances my black-and-white point. (Not that it doesn't stand. Most Flash-game developers are exactly what I described.)

I guess you're expecting me to say that independence means the developer doing whatever the hell they want, without any risk of getting budget cuts or getting fired or what-not. However, people these days are naturally inclined to follow trends, even if obscure ones, so they're never truly independent in that sense.

Also, it's not like most people with good ideas have money to spare to pay for a team to make it work by him/herself. They usually have to ask for financing and whoever pays, always has some nudging power, even if only in the developer's subconscious.

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Independent means to me: not owned by a corporation, in control of itself and secure in its creative freedom from outside investors. Usually these are small teams, but Bungie (now) would be an example of a large 'indie', though its partnership with Activision might invalidate those definitions...

So, I rarely use the term due to its vagary. Heck, I'm technically a cofounder of a small studio in Utah and I don't call ourselves 'indie', since like the posts here shows, everyone tends to have their own definition of this word. It also varies drastically between mediums. "Indie" in music can be my brother playing at the bar and selling cds to the style of music of the Shins, etc. Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll. I can't tell most of the time.

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

Wait… the Crysis 2 published by Electronic Arts with the storyline of incomprehensible technobable? How does that game qualify as indie or likeable???

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

Wait… the Crysis 2 published by Electronic Arts with the storyline of incomprehensible technobable? How does that game qualify as indie or likeable???

Journey , the darling indie game of everybody, was published by Sony. What's your point?

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

Wait… the Crysis 2 published by Electronic Arts with the storyline of incomprehensible technobable? How does that game qualify as indie or likeable???

Journey , the darling indie game of everybody, was published by Sony. What's your point?

There were two points:

1. Crysis 2 was not indie because it was a mass market game by well known developers that had EA as a major backer.
2. Crysis 2 had a terrible, incomphrensible, unlikable storyline that consisted of way too much meaningless technobable and I wonder what you liked about it.

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

Wait… the Crysis 2 published by Electronic Arts with the storyline of incomprehensible technobable? How does that game qualify as indie or likeable???

Journey , the darling indie game of everybody, was published by Sony. What's your point?

There were two points:

1. Crysis 2 was not indie because it was a mass market game by well known developers that had EA as a major backer.

Sony poured millions (literally) into journey. If you go by money and / or team size, Journey isn't indie either.

Ask yourself why one would need to make a distinction between large and small budget games.

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

I liked Crysis 2 and that was indie.

Wait… the Crysis 2 published by Electronic Arts with the storyline of incomprehensible technobable? How does that game qualify as indie or likeable???

Journey , the darling indie game of everybody, was published by Sony. What's your point?

There were two points:

1. Crysis 2 was not indie because it was a mass market game by well known developers that had EA as a major backer.

Sony poured millions (literally) into journey. If you go by money and / or team size, Journey isn't indie either.

Ask yourself why one would need to make a distinction between large and small budget games.

You're the one who brought up Journey and its status. I've never played the game, have never seen it played, and don't care about it. Since you're ignoring point 2 (and since it's a bit off topic anyway) let's stick to point one.

How do you justify Crysis 2 as indie?

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You're the one who brought up Journey and its status. I've never played the game, have never seen it played, and don't care about it. Since you're ignoring point 2 (and since it's a bit off topic anyway) let's stick to point one.

How do you justify Crysis 2 as indie?

Crytek paid for Crysis. EA published it, so what? There is talk of EA acquiring Crytek, so I guess if that happens they'd no longer be indie.

Crytek developed their own engine and tools for Crysis.

That alone makes them more independent than 90% of the 'indie games'.

As for point 2 the combat and world was really fun.

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You're the one who brought up Journey and its status. I've never played the game, have never seen it played, and don't care about it. Since you're ignoring point 2 (and since it's a bit off topic anyway) let's stick to point one.

How do you justify Crysis 2 as indie?

Crytek paid for Crysis. EA published it, so what? There is talk of EA acquiring Crytek, so I guess if that happens they'd no longer be indie.

Crytek developed their own engine and tools for Crysis.

That alone makes them more independent than 90% of the 'indie games'.

Interesting. I bought Crysis 2 but I never thought of it as indie. Maybe subconsciously my idea of indie includes a rule that the games isn't distributed on disc with a fancy case... But thats an assumption that has no place in our increasingly digital world...

As for point 2 the combat and world was really fun.

I actually partially agree. I really liked the feel of the nano suit. It felt a lot like Halo 4 (or rather Halo 4 felt a lot like it) but even more mobile and useful. Doubly so when you included the cloak and armor modes. The game also had the best invasion of earth... visually and thematically... of any game I've played. Mass Effect 3 comes next, and they both beat the pants off of Halo. I believed Earth was in trouble while playing Crysis 2. Not so much while kicking the Covenant out of New Mombassa...

I didn't really enjoy the actual combat unfortunately. Too hard to kill enemies. Too little ammo. And of course the story and plot was just awful.

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Crytek developed their own engine and tools for Crysis.

That alone makes them more independent than 90% of the 'indie games'.

Knowing a lot of indie and hobbyist game developers and having taken part in 24 hour and weekend game jams, I would suggest that number might be way off.

But once again, it depends on your definition of "indie".

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Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll.

Heh. Yep.

And as you say, indie is very hard to nail down. It, in my mind, doesn't seem to have to do with funding. Kickstarted games are equally independent as any other, even when they get millions in funding. I would say that indie games can't be done by a major studio, but then the Bungie / Destiny example kinda breaks that since they "bought back" their freedom from Microsoft so they could make Destiny. But weirdly I also don't see Destiny as an independent game, so independent doesn't seem to really mean independent freedom of ideas…

I suppose my definition of an indie game then is this: A good if edgy game, done on a budget, with a limited number of developers, most or all of whom I personally have never heard of. :)

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Heck, I'm technically a cofounder of a small studio in Utah and I don't call ourselves 'indie', since like the posts here shows, everyone tends to have their own definition of this word. It also varies drastically between mediums. "Indie" in music can be my brother playing at the bar and selling cds to the style of music of the Shins, etc. Cody's definition of indie appears to be "games I don't like", unless he's just playing the troll. I can't tell most of the time.

Are you from Utah? If so what part (if you don't mind me asking)? Also I love the Shins. That is all.

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Are you from Utah? If so what part (if you don't mind me asking)? Also I love the Shins. That is all.

My friend from college, we built some small game prototypes together (and are still working on stuff, though it's on the backburner at the moment). He moved to Salt Lake City a year after graduation, and so the studio, Commonwealth Industries, is registered in Utah. He's now making some other games with it under the Commonwealth umbrella.

But I have been there once. I saw some pretty water and rocks, got frustrated by a highway, then went on to Seattle.

Which songs do the Shins do again?

And yes, you decided my outfit for the day.

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Which songs do the Shins do again?

And yes, you decided my outfit for the day.

Oh they just wrote some of my favorite songs. Do you like the Broken Bells also? If so they just announced a new album.

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Which songs do the Shins do again?

And yes, you decided my outfit for the day.

Oh they just wrote some of my favorite songs. Do you like the Broken Bells also? If so they just announced a new album.

Ooooh, that's fantastic! Thanks for letting me know, I've been waiting for a second go - I just throw the first one in with the rest of the great Shins albums in my head. :)

"Vaporize". The lyrics have described my last few years. Hell, it's in the official Mayflower Soundtrack.

(We haven't gotten any others on Vinyll yet, but Chutes Too Narrow has been up on the wall till recently - we switch out album covers every few months to keep things fresh.)

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That means none of the indie games funded through kickstarter are indie then, because folks kicking in aren;t directly related to the development.

So the glory and inherent downfall of kickstarter is the issue of trust. I have to trust that this team can make this project work with the money I'm contributing, then there's the issue of will they make it work. What really makes a kickstarter developer free or more or less independent is, they only have to answer to me (the benefactor/owner) once. Once the money has been pledged, they are free to do whatever they want, they don't even need to deliver.

What gives them independence and makes me afraid is there is nothing legally stopping them from promising this and delivering that much differently than what was promised. If you get a half million dollars to make a classic JRPG and instead use it to make a $500,000 bologna sandwich, there is nothing legally wrong with that.

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Yeah I totally understand where you're coming from. So far I have not been burned on Kickstarter, but I usually consider it more of a donation than a pre-purchase. The only exceptions have been with people that are prominent (like webcomics or established game designers) whom I expect to deliver or they will get a backlash they can't afford. In fact the only Kickstarter that didn't get 100% fulfilled was by a webcomic creator who actually gave back all the contributions when he realized he couldn't fulfill it. (I actually ended up letting him keep mine because he's a friend of mine)

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I totally understand it's a journey, some people definitely make up for it. Like Doublefine's kickstarter they also had the documentary going on to give you some immediate content. IMO I've already made my money back just from watching those. That's also why I'm not mad they have deadline issues going on all over the place.

Sorry to hear about your friend btw.

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Sorry to hear about your friend btw.

He's doing okay, he draws covers for Bravest Warriors and does animation contracts, it's mostly sad because he obviously prefers to make his own comics. But you guys should check out his online comic, it's hilarious (and insane at times).

Here is a taste of his insanity:

[image]

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How are you friends with Boxerhockey? As much as I know it kills him, my favorite of his stuff is the sonic parody stuff. It's hilarious.

I used to listen to a bunch of Wha-chow a few years ago, so I know of him.

It's super eerie to me when I start seeing people I recognize from one part of the internet on a whole different part. Small fuckin world.

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How are you friends with Boxerhockey?

I actually grew up with him in North Carolina. It's actually really strange to me to think that he is something of a minor Internet celebrity.

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and be called something completely different.

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This last question is a long form essay. No minimum length as long as you make your points convincingly.

Why is the notion of 'indie' a myth? What makes this distinction for video games non sensical? How does this contribute to the decline in the way we talk and think about video games as an art form?

First essay to get an A (if any do) wins a $20 steam card. Enough to buy like 3 indie games! :-p

The notion of indie is a myth, or at the very least a misnomer, because to gain audience, legitimacy, and/or a market a developer must use an established platform (i.e. XBL, Steam, the Internet) to release their product. In the case of self publishing, one could argue that this avoids using pre-established or endorsed platforms to release and circumvents the "sellout" stigma and unnecessarily paying the corporate overlords to release said game. While this in theory is good, and excellent for publicity, the end game is still the same as most small games or developers. That is to become legitimate by releasing games to a wide audience, receive praise in some way (not necessary, but the next part is), and making money. At the end of the day, indie (not to be confused with independent) is a state of mind more than a state of being, because they are constantly heading down a path toward relevancy, and that makes them less and less indie the more integrated and successful they become. For example, if someone starts as a part of the counter culture until that becomes the mainstream culture, they are no longer the counter culture.

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The notion of indie is a myth, or at the very least a misnomer, because to gain audience, legitimacy, and/or a market a developer must use an established platform (i.e. XBL, Steam, the Internet) to release their product.

You are on to something. However, it goes further. To exists AT ALL means relying on established platforms, does it not?

On the right track.

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You're stuck, as always, on black and white. No nation is independent because it relies on resources and interactions with other nations. No person is free because everyone must conform to laws, even if they are only the natural laws.

In terms of media, "indie" doesn't mean total independence from all pre-existing support structures; it just means independence of support from a large publisher.

Indie music is music which is produced independent of a record label. It doesn't matter if it's distributed via MySpace, Bandcamp, Facebook, e-mail, or by hollering off your back porch, it is still independent, because indie doesn't mean independent of everything, but specifically of a record company. There is music which is called indie inaccurately, because it fits a style that folks have come to associate with indie music but has been picked up. It is a state of being, not a style of production.

Journey isn't indie because it's published, as you pointed out, by a major publisher. Whether or not a game is distributed on Steam or XBLA or whatever is irrelevant. Counterstrike was an indie game, because it was developed independent of Valve. It no longer is, because it has been picked up by Valve.

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In terms of media, "indie" doesn't mean total independence from all pre-existing support structures; it just means independence of support from a large publisher.

Why is this valued or praised?

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In terms of media, "indie" doesn't mean total independence from all pre-existing support structures; it just means independence of support from a large publisher.

Why is this valued or praised?

The idea is that it has greater purity of creation. They're not worried about 'return on investment' as heads of (especially large) record companies would be. So they don't alter their sound or image to appeal to a wider audience in the hope that'll be more profitable.

Funnily enough, the way it's going these days, both very small/new and very successful recording artists are getting distribution-only deals.

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As others have suggested, being free from an established publisher frees you from certain expectations. Whether or not you take advantage of this freedom has nothing to do with your circumstances, but with your quality as a designer. Being an indie developer is circumstantially beneficial to taking risks that might be, in a corporate setting, discouraged or doused entirely. That doesn't mean that corporate games can't be innovative, and it doesn't mean that indie games must be.

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As others have suggested, being free from an established publisher frees you from certain expectations. Whether or not you take advantage of this freedom has nothing to do with your circumstances, but with your quality as a designer.

I believe this is demonstrably false. Kickstarter should free indie developers up the most, because they don't even have to worry about return on investment. But what games are getting funded through kickstarter? Retro, utterly traditional games that take few risks.

If anything you have more to lose if your game fails as an indie!

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Well, that's where the subconscious part comes in. Developers looking for funding are trying to 'go with the flow' that will give them enough resources. As such, even though they're on paper completely independent, they're still following some sort of trend (in my opinion, initiated by games like Castle Crashers, a very successful retro-style game, and Minecraft, the most successful truly-indie title I know of). They're pretty much still people trying to accepted in the society.

Now, truly innovating games are still being independently developed as 'indies' all over the place, they just don't get the marketing pseudo-indies or going-with-the-flow-indies do.

For instance, I've recently heard of a game which has just been Greenlit on Steam in that you must actively operate every element of the gun to be able to shoot and reload it. As in, release the cylinder, prop it open, empty it, refill it bullet by bullet, replace the cylinder and cock the revolver, using the revolver as example. They're currently studying how to make it work with LeapMotion right now, if I'm not mistaken.

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I'm always reminded of this when the distinction arises:

though it doesn't make the full translation for games, most of it is there.

I think the bigger reasoning behind the distinction lies in implication rather than execution. While independent may be more honest (or at least descriptive), indie evokes a greater emotional response in the audience. The difference is independent describes nothing about them other than who is or isn't paying the bills/ who is or isn't in direct control of development, while indie describes the same thing, but implies much more. It implies a different train of thought, it implies genre breaking or genre fusing, it implies non-typical and possibility driven games in story, music, etc. It boils down to the implication of games or a style of games too niche or odd to be made by a publisher seeking big revenue and big audiences.

So indie technically isn't a genre or type of game or developer, it's a brand.

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while indie describes the same thing, but implies much more. It implies a different train of thought, it implies genre breaking or genre fusing, it implies non-typical and possibility driven games in story, music, etc.

So indie technically isn't a genre or type of game or developer, it's a brand.

Excellent. You are almost there.

So how does the 'indie brand' tie into the decline of the quality of video games, and video games discussion? Think about your definition of genre breaking / non typical etc. How is the indie brand NOT doing this?

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It doesn't defy genre standards when it standardized that type of genre breaking and fusion. I'm sure your dark, edgy platformer about young innocents learning about death and a hostile world is great, but everybody's doing that now. Indie has an established style, thought process, and brand identity now, that's exactly what makes it incapable of what it promises. Anytime you have this happen across a trend, you have stand outs that leverage all the best qualities, but you also have a lot of games riding the trend wave.

It's safe, but it seems edgy. Not saying safe is inherently bad, making a game that has no proven appeal or audience must be fucking terrifying.

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This discussion reminds me of my days playing religious music (circa 1995-2007). "Christian Contempory Music" was (and still is, I imagine?) used as cover for a vast majority of work that was, quite plainly, shit.

Is Indie to video games what CCM is to music?

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Well Christian Contemporary definitely hits a point, it describes content, branding, and mannerisms of the music, but it doesn't describe the music itself. Much of Christian contemporary follows modern country in terms of genre, but that not all ccm. I have heard some christian metal that was good metal, as well as having the branding, message, etc. (reliant k, family force 5... I think)

So to back to indie, it's not quite a full translation (it never really is). There definitely the branding, content, mannerisms, etc. that someone would describe as indie, but there is also actual aspects of gameplay that some would associate with the indie brand as well. Off the top of my head, something like story details revealed by gameplay interaction or game objective, but that's not exclusive to indie. So I think it goes a bit deeper than CCM is to music, but at the end of the day it has an intrinsic value that is considered by the buyer. I definitely think the indie brand sells games that would normally be passed over.

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I definitely think the indie brand sells games that would normally be passed over.

Good post, and I'm with you on that all that. The above I think is a very important point, that I wanted to highlight.

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This discussion reminds me of my days playing religious music (circa 1995-2007). "Christian Contempory Music" was (and still is, I imagine?) used as cover for a vast majority of work that was, quite plainly, shit.

Is Indie to video games what CCM is to music?

Go on. Tie in branding, the generally accepted definition of indie, and you are both pretty close.

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This discussion reminds me of my days playing religious music (circa 1995-2007). "Christian Contempory Music" was (and still is, I imagine?) used as cover for a vast majority of work that was, quite plainly, shit.

Is Indie to video games what CCM is to music?

Go on. Tie in branding, the generally accepted definition of indie, and you are both pretty close.

Do people think something along the lines of this?

"Indie" are ground breaking, experimental titles. Unless they're not. But hey, it's Indie, so it must be? Better buy it, just in case, and critically debate it on the internet.

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pre·ten·tious
adjective
1. attempting to impress by affecting greater importance, talent, culture, etc., than is actually possessed.
"a pretentious literary device"

The brand of indie is most certainly pretense, whether or not it's of value or good is lost by the "genius visionaries breaking through the facade of mainstream blah blah".

There is a market for it, that's really as far as the thought goes for some.

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pre·ten·tious
adjective
1. attempting to impress by affecting greater importance, talent, culture, etc., than is actually possessed.
"a pretentious literary device"

The brand of indie is most certainly pretense, whether or not it's of value or good is lost by the "genius visionaries breaking through the facade of mainstream blah blah".

There is a market for it, that's really as far as the thought goes for some.

Working with "indie" game developers, I don't see any of this nonsense as accurate for such wide range of creations. People are using some documentary or scandalous news or the trend of labeling and hating "hipsters" to stereotype a games instead of trying games they haven't heard of before, often handcrafted by passionate and self-disciplined designers and artists, a range that includes titles that have just as great of chance of being terrible or fantastic as "AAA" games, which is another term stereotyped as much or more than "indie".

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Working with "indie" game developers, I don't see any of this nonsense as accurate for such wide range of creations. People are using some documentary or scandalous news or the trend of labeling and hating "hipsters" to stereotype a games instead of trying games they haven't heard of before, often handcrafted by passionate and self-disciplined designers and artists, a range that includes titles that have just as great of chance of being terrible or fantastic as "AAA" games, which is another term stereotyped as much or more than "indie".

The pretentiousness is mostly on the side of the gamers and journalists.

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The pretentiousness is mostly on the side of the gamers and journalists.

Ah, the people I don't listen to. I used to love my subscription to EGM back in the 90's and at the turn of the century (and still read those old mags from time to time), but I haven't read a game-related journalism piece in years, unless linked to from these (or HBO's) forums, and boy am I happier gamer for it.

Oh yeah... "gamer"... another word I hate. I guess I'm also a reader, comic-booker, filmer, paintinger, architecturer... If I was obssessed with gamers, I'd be a gamerer! And...

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I love all those things, but "gamer" sounds isolating in its definition, as if that's all you consume. I don't have a need for such a word. If I ever need to explain, I can say "I sometimes play video games", and not pin myself down and limit myself in others' eyes. Because I despise being pinned down. Because I am rarely a pin.

It doesn't help that it's often used in an elitist terminology to refer to those who are true gamers as opposed to casuals or something. It's like a reverse hipster, another word I'm sick of. It's caught on. It's popular now to make fun of people with that term, and people have enlarged the breadth of the definition to use it to basically condemn anyone they think is weird or makes them uncomfortable. The ideologies of superiority/inferiority in these matters makes me so mad I have to go mow a lawn.

So anyway, if I do say I'm a gamer, I feel I have to say I'm an everythinger to balance it out.

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The ideologies of superiority/inferiority in these matters makes me so mad I have to go mow a lawn.

I'll have to have you over when the grass gets tall and talk about how doctor who is too British to be legitimately enjoyed, you are an untapped resource.

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The ideologies of superiority/inferiority in these matters makes me so mad I have to go mow a lawn.

I'll have to have you over when the grass gets tall and talk about how doctor who is too British to be legitimately enjoyed, you are an untapped resource.

Yeah... well... That. Doesn't. Bother. Me.

[image]

Control your emotions, Leviathan, control them---

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[image]

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Working with "indie" game developers, I don't see any of this nonsense as accurate for such wide range of creations. People are using some documentary or scandalous news or the trend of labeling and hating "hipsters" to stereotype a games instead of trying games they haven't heard of before, often handcrafted by passionate and self-disciplined designers and artists, a range that includes titles that have just as great of chance of being terrible or fantastic as "AAA" games, which is another term stereotyped as much or more than "indie".

The pretentiousness is mostly on the side of the gamers and journalists.

So, resolving some cognitive dissonance?

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Like Cody said, the pretense lies mostly in those furthest from the actual creation of the game. The branding and marketing will raise whatever hell to move that product, or convince someone they are being paid to do so. Some marketing departments are the most backward strategists I've ever worked with.

Not saying all devs are off the hook, Phil fish seems to be the poster boy for this right now.

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Why is the notion of 'indie' a myth? What makes this distinction for video games non sensical? How does this contribute to the decline in the way we talk and think about video games as an art form?

Indie as myth: Because games are games are games.

Since the age of reliable internet distribution, XBOX Live indie game marketplace, Steam: Greenlight, desure, indiecity, etc, the term indie games has gotten popular. But what is the difference between an 'indie' game and a non-indie game? Nothing. A video game is a video game, and as such, should be judged by the same metric.

But you can go back further: iD software started with a handful of guys and at some point in the late 80s/early 90s Doom ended up being installed on more computers than Windows. (I got this from an interview with Gabe Newell a while back, too busy to cite sources right now.) By todays standards, they would be indie--people say Minecraft is indie all the time, but it has sold millions of copies.

So what is the purpose of the indie tag? For me, it adjusts the buyer's expectations. I go into GTA V and I think, there is going to be this huge world, tons of cars, NPCs, guns, cool AI, a huge story, voice acting, the list goes on.

If I pull up the XBLIG marketplace (which I don't do as much anymore, honestly), I'm not going to have those expectations. I will be pleased if I see a game that ISN'T about farting, or maybe it will have graphics that don't make my eyes bleed, or maybe it looks like the game is done. Oh, and maybe I'll enjoy it--but I wouldn't hold my breath.

As far as art? People spend years arguing about what art is--artist and art historians (Source: Art Major, liberal arts college). Is sculpture art? Is photography art? Are installations art? Does Banksy make art? Is the guy from Exit From the Gift Shop a Real Artist or is he Faking It?

My personal opinion is that having some kind of divide between indie games and games is just a distraction in the bigger question of "Are Video Games Art." For me, if someone can say a film (or, god forbid, a MOVIE) is art, then yeah, you can say that video games are art.

Now to let the cat out of the bag: I made an indie game. It's not a great game, but I have played worse. I made it in about 5 weeks with C# & XNA last winter break. I made all the music and graphics too. Here it is: Interstellar Flower Power.

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Now to let the cat out of the bag: I made an indie game. It's not a great game, but I have played worse. I made it in about 5 weeks with C# & XNA last winter break. I made all the music and graphics too. Here it is: Interstellar Flower Power.

Congrats on making a game, and congrats on a good response.

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I'll give the card to you. Email me with your details.

cody @ halo4.isnotcanon.net

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Whoa, Cool. I just emailed you.

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http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039948781

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Indie Game Exam Question 3 (FINAL) (Gaming)