Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

You kind of have a point, and maybe I just imagined the challenge mode as being for the really hardcore.

In your imagination everything in the entire game is only for the really hardcore.

By any normal player's definition, and there are probably millions of them, every single player in this forum is "really hardcore".

Sounds like a counterproductive cheese, then, especially when the gaze holder is literally the easiest responsibility in any raid ever... You just stand in one spot and shoot at the exact same spot. Why would someone want to complicate it?

Not mention how the hell is the gazer supposed to even GET the damn gaze if the window to shoot is tiny? Hell, I've always been on gaze duty and I have to move around a LOT to get Golgy's back...

Ugh, plus it just doesn't sound fun.

I mean, I know a lot of people just want to play for the drops, but this sounds like hiding under the stairs for Valus Ta'aurc, which is the least fun I've ever had in a video game ever. Why would anyone want to spend their free time doing that?

Okay, I can see that. I guess I'm willing to wait and see if ALL of the challenges are as 'easy' as this one before writing off the concept, though. :)

Oh, don't get me wrong, so am I. Like I said, I'm definitely in the camp of even this "easy" challenge would probably be difficult for me.

I just think there's merit in having an activity that really is designed for the super hardcore. Not everyone has to do everything, and I'm okay with the idea that not everyone CAN do everything. Trials gives lets us see that side of things a bit, but I think this could potentially be a good PvE equivalent to that, if they actually make it that challenging.

Sounds like a counterproductive cheese, then, especially when the gaze holder is literally the easiest responsibility in any raid ever... You just stand in one spot and shoot at the exact same spot. Why would someone want to complicate it?

Not mention how the hell is the gazer supposed to even GET the damn gaze if the window to shoot is tiny? Hell, I've always been on gaze duty and I have to move around a LOT to get Golgy's back...

the gaze holder is literally the easiest responsibility in any raid ever...

How dare you.

-left hidden Oracle sniper

The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

lol - I think 'skewed the stats' might be the wrong way to put it. ;)

The stats are the way they are because THE MAJORITY OF PLAYERS AREN'T AS GOOD AS THE PEOPLE COMPLAINING THAT THIS IS TOO EASY.

skewed in the sense that a lot of ppl are playing with randoms vs a set group of close friends. the better randoms don't like to waste time, so they say "let me run aura so we can get this over with." The less experienced players agree b/c it makes it easier on everyone.

Same with gaze and relic runners.

Heck, to this day, how many of our long-time friends are afraid to run the Crota sword?
How many have never tried the Templar/Gatekeeper Relic?
Some people are permanently afraid to step out of their comfort zone, and so permanently delegate responsibility to others.

Speaking of gaze, has anyone seen the gaze "cheese spot" on the left side of the room? I've run into a couple of groups that have done it. Doesn't seem like it's spread a lot yet. There is a crevice in the wall on the left side that you can climb into where you can see and shoot Golg, but none of the balls can hit you.

It's a pain to get in and out of, so the gaze runner stays in there the whole fight. They have such a narrow sliver to shoot through, that they really can't help with the adds or the orbs, so you basically a man down the whole time.

Sounds like a counterproductive cheese, then, especially when the gaze holder is literally the easiest responsibility in any raid ever... You just stand in one spot and shoot at the exact same spot. Why would someone want to complicate it?

I guess I'm willing to wait and see if ALL of the challenges are as 'easy' as this one before writing off the concept, though. :)

There's where you've gone wrong. Withholding judgment until you get more information is a common mistake internet noobs make. Here's an algorithm for you for future Destiny features.

1. Hype yourself up for an upcoming feature. It will be exactly what you want it to be and in no way different.
2. Become so easily enraged that a stray word or phrase could set you off.
3. Acknowledge your superiority in game design knowledge. Never having designed a game yourself is actually a huge benefit in criticizing others.
4. Know 100% of people have the same opinions as you, and if they don't, they are stupid.
5. Never, EVER, withhold judgment. If at all possible, judge something before it's even revealed to you.
6. If your judgment was wrong, and it's good, never mention the feature again. If your judgment was wrong and its bad, bring it up constantly as an example of #3 or #4.

If you can follow these steps, you'll have success in online game forums.

The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

lol - I think 'skewed the stats' might be the wrong way to put it. ;)

The stats are the way they are because THE MAJORITY OF PLAYERS AREN'T AS GOOD AS THE PEOPLE COMPLAINING THAT THIS IS TOO EASY.

skewed in the sense that a lot of ppl are playing with randoms vs a set group of close friends. the better randoms don't like to waste time, so they say "let me run aura so we can get this over with." The less experienced players agree b/c it makes it easier on everyone.

Same with gaze and relic runners.

Speaking of gaze, has anyone seen the gaze "cheese spot" on the left side of the room? I've run into a couple of groups that have done it. Doesn't seem like it's spread a lot yet. There is a crevice in the wall on the left side that you can climb into where you can see and shoot Golg, but none of the balls can hit you.

It's a pain to get in and out of, so the gaze runner stays in there the whole fight. They have such a narrow sliver to shoot through, that they really can't help with the adds or the orbs, so you basically a man down the whole time.

Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

You kind of have a point, and maybe I just imagined the challenge mode as being for the really hardcore.

Why would I pass up the opportunity at a 320 weapon, even though I'm not hardcore?

(There is nowhere else in the game that guarantees that prize for successful completion of a task. Nowhere.)

I don't think he's saying that you should.

I see where he's coming from though. If random LFG groups are struggling with just the HM raid, they're obviously going to struggle with the Challenge mode. So why even take them into account? It should be for the hardcore (and I'm definitely not even in that group; I've yet to do a HM raid, and I'll probably never do this). But at some point, if you're advertising things that are especially challenging, but the hardcore folks that would probably get the most out of don't find it challenging . . . what's the point?

Okay, I can see that. I guess I'm willing to wait and see if ALL of the challenges are as 'easy' as this one before writing off the concept, though. :)

Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

You kind of have a point, and maybe I just imagined the challenge mode as being for the really hardcore.

Why would I pass up the opportunity at a 320 weapon, even though I'm not hardcore?

(There is nowhere else in the game that guarantees that prize for successful completion of a task. Nowhere.)

I don't think he's saying that you should.

I see where he's coming from though. If random LFG groups are struggling with just the HM raid, they're obviously going to struggle with the Challenge mode. So why even take them into account? It should be for the hardcore (and I'm definitely not even in that group; I've yet to do a HM raid, and I'll probably never do this). But at some point, if you're advertising things that are especially challenging, but the hardcore folks that would probably get the most out of don't find it challenging . . . what's the point?

Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

You kind of have a point, and maybe I just imagined the challenge mode as being for the really hardcore.

Why would I pass up the opportunity at a 320 weapon, even though I'm not hardcore?

(There is nowhere else in the game that guarantees that prize for successful completion of a task. Nowhere.)

The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

lol - I think 'skewed the stats' might be the wrong way to put it. ;)

The stats are the way they are because THE MAJORITY OF PLAYERS AREN'T AS GOOD AS THE PEOPLE COMPLAINING THAT THIS IS TOO EASY.

I also agree with Korny that it's not unlikely that the first challenge is a gimme, of sorts, just to test the waters. (And when I say 'a gimme', I mean 'easy for folks who do this stuff in their sleep'. Again, the vast majority of players aren't good enough to find this to be trivial. I've run Warpriest a couple of dozen times, with lots and lots of different groups - and it is NOT uncommon, in the pickup-style groups I play with, for someone to die with the aura. That means it transfers to a random person - and it's quite possible for that random person to have already held it on a previous round. It's not even a mistake (well, other than letting yourself die) - it's just RNG.)

Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

You kind of have a point, and maybe I just imagined the challenge mode as being for the really hardcore.

You don't have to change your strategy at all for this. That's why it's not a 'challenge'. It's what our crew basically has been doing all along. That is why it's disappointing. You shouldn't release a challenge mode where people have already beaten your challenges through their normal play even before it launches. It's basically a 'free' drop for us tonight.

I'm not able to get on until pretty late sometimes, so i miss out on the DBO raids and end up running a lot with LFG groups. A lot of these ppl are making the host run aura (since the timer is often wrong and you can lose the aura when the timer is around 3 secs), or the lowest level player, or whomever is just "good" at it.

For people that run it all the time with the same group/clan, this challenge won't be an issue. But it will be an issue with LFG players that are used to being carried. There will probably be a lot of wipes b/c the aura holder died and it transfers to someone that already had it, or someone accidentally grabs it twice b/c that is a habit that is hard to break.

Since this is part of the challenge, i'm assuming that it's a traceable stat that Bungie looked at when coming up with the challenges. The prevalence of LFG groups probably skewed the stats.

I know I and another guy have basically pulled groups through the normal mode raid, and we tended to be the relic holder/ main DPS in the group. While the Warpriest challenge isn't too hard for an experienced group, for some of the average groups it would be an issue as the Sherpa or two can't do all the work.

They didn't "hype it up" in the sense that they said it would be super mega different. For Hard raid they said it would be an extra plate to spin. They specifically tried to tone down expectations, and for this, they said you'd need to change your strategy for the boss fights, which is most likely true, unless you're used to running with a whole crew that likes to grab the Aura.

You don't have to change your strategy at all for this. That's why it's not a 'challenge'. It's what our crew basically has been doing all along. That is why it's disappointing. You shouldn't release a challenge mode where people have already beaten your challenges through their normal play even before it launches. It's basically a 'free' drop for us tonight.

This is an easy week. I'm sure the free drop is intentional. There are plenty of folks crying about being underleveled, so why would the first week of challenges require you to beat the Warpriest with Swords only?

Either way, this is a great way to get higher Light items, if you have some teammates who don't play endgame too often, or who need a higher light artifact. It's a guaranteed drop for doing something specific. Isn't that what you're always clamoring for?

Yeah, that's great. I'm not complaining about that at all. But it's disappointing that we'll essentially get those without having to change our strategy at all tonight. I don't think you can really argue that the expectation for a challenge mode is something different and challenging.

There are a few tweaks to make the fight more challenging. A vast number of teams are going to struggle with this, so it has to be an accommodating challenge. I expect your group to get it done in a single run on Hard, since it's so easy...

Judging by this week, i will take a guess and say that Oryx will require a different relic runner each time.

Now that would actually be a really interesting twist to that fight!

I'm still waiting for Gogoroth to blind the subject of his gaze, so someone else has to shoot the tracking orbs :-p