So, +9.7-9=+0.7...

If they weren't powerful enough before how does dialing them back to almost exactly what they were make sense? Unless my vague feeling is correct and other guns like Assault Rifles and Shotgun getting nerfed since then has shifted the whole sandbox's time to kill a bit higher?

Time to Kill is def up across cross the entire sandbox since 2.0, I think Wisnewski mentoined that on a Crucible radio podcast.

Post thorn/tlw/shotgun dynamics it's probably up about 25%.

In that context then the nerf fits in pretty well, and it will probably keep pulse average TTKs in line. The effect of the range nerf is perhaps more important. If that gets pulled back too far then hitting those bursts is going to be rough, and even though the damage drop is fairly small, there's going to be a lot more 4-5 burst fights.

If hand cannons end up very reliable, they may being beastly again. Three shot hand cannons have low TTks.

Yeah, it was around the third stupid nerf that I realized Xbox folks would never really get Hawkmoon. That weapon went from Gjallarhorn to Nechrochasm by the time September rolled around, and that really sucked.

Similar situation for the Horseman. It's still a fantastic gun, but back when it did 200% damage? Lawd...

That's why I'm worried about Jade Rabbit. So far, PS4 exclusives have truly been exclusive. Hawkmoon was the free weapon that I got from Rahool, and it went straight to the vault after the first missions.

If there's one thing that I hate about Destiny, it's how overboard Bungie goes with applying multiple nerfs to a weapon at a time (usually applied with a general class nerf, too), and Hawkmoon got it like no other, which is frustrating, because there was nothing quite as satisfying as the Magic Bullet...

I think if as a rule they just make every change they do half as much, then the situation will be better.

Every change is just this drastic reaction to the current preferences and strategies. Auto Rifles are too good. Okay we'll nerf them. Now Hand Cannons are too strong. Okay nerf those. Now we have pulses on top. Nerf those. People are just going to flock to whatever works and is best. The shotgun nerfs are too much. If you have their range drop to melee range, then you need a way to get in close. That means quick scope and blink. But no, Bungie nerfed those, so now it's oing to be harder to get in, and shotguns will primarily be for campers. This is the nerf (minus the ads and movement speed tweaks) that needed to be done ages ago, before they nerfed blink.

As for Hawkmoon, I spent 50 weeks trying to get it, only to have it now be garbage because of the hand cannon nerfs. Every single patch hawkmoon loses effectiveness in some way. I was a good weapon, but I've always felt it was a poorly designed one. It's basically "This gun sometimes does extra damage, sometimes a lot extra". That is the most boring thing ever. Exotic should be exotic.

These drastic changes suck, because it's super hard to level up your weapons now. You put time into getting a weapon up to par, and then it suddenly becomes garbage. That's not cool at all.

The solution is more frequent, smaller changes. Not only would that prevent the overreacting, but it would give you time to phase out your weapons.

Similar situation for the Horseman. It's still a fantastic gun, but back when it did 200% damage? Lawd...

That's why I'm worried about Jade Rabbit. So far, PS4 exclusives have truly been exclusive. Hawkmoon was the free weapon that I got from Rahool, and it went straight to the vault after the first missions.

If there's one thing that I hate about Destiny, it's how overboard Bungie goes with applying multiple nerfs to a weapon at a time (usually applied with a general class nerf, too), and Hawkmoon got it like no other, which is frustrating, because there was nothing quite as satisfying as the Magic Bullet...

…blah blah blah blah I HAVE JADE RABBIT NEENER NEENER blah blah blah blah…

I'm with Cruel - I'm never going to see the Rabbit this year. Destiny seems to think that I REALLY want a bunch of Hereafters instead.

At least you guys have a chance at it. By the time us Xbox players can get it, it'll be nerfed all to hell, just like Hawkmoon was. ): I got a Hawkmoon a week after TTK dropped and thought, "This is it?" That gun blows chunks.

I'm with Cruel - I'm never going to see the Rabbit this year. Destiny seems to think that I REALLY want a bunch of Hereafters instead.

Also, when I'm watching football games on Sundays, I kill the gatekeeper during each commercial break.

note: Because you can kill him soooo quickly, I don't recommend just farming him over and over since there's still a 5-6 minute hidden cooldown on the 3 of Coins, and sitting in orbit for 5 minutes between runs is boring.

Jade Rabbit has grown on me. When I first got it, I just thought it was utter garbage. I don't like the sight, don't like the sfx, the kick is slightly off... But now I love the damn thing. Plus it has a bunny on it!

Keep using those 3s of Coins and farming the gatekeeper and you'll get one eventually.

I've seen people mention this before... is there a particular reason that farming the Gatekeeper is more effective than simply running strikes? Is there a higher drop rate for some reason?

Keep using those 3s of Coins and farming the gatekeeper and you'll get one eventually.

The only reason I even use Tlaloc is that MIDA rate of fire. Now I can have it all the time without holding onto my Super :D

In case you missed this :)

Last night I was wrecking the world with my Jade Rabbit. Honestly the best I've ever done in Iron Banner, ever.

I think Bungie just accidentally made Tlaloc a super weapon. Ahah pun intended. Seriously, that scout was bonkers good before the update.

Last night I was wrecking the world with my Jade Rabbit. Honestly the best I've ever done in Iron Banner, ever.

With the new changes, every other archetype is getting nerfed except for scouts. The net result is that scouts are about to rise well above the rest of the fray.

Jade Rabbit and I are the year 2 equivalent of Cody and the Hawkmoon. It's the gun I've wanted most since I first laid eyes on it, yet it continues to evade me. Hope I'm able to get one to drop eventually :)

In the meantime, I've actually had a lot of luck with Hung Jury from time to time. I need to adjust my playstyle and hang back a bit more than usual. Once I get into that mode, it works quite nicely.

With the new changes, every other archetype is getting nerfed except for scouts. The net result is that scouts are about to rise well above the rest of the fray.