My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

Why do you include yourself? How do you know?

I know firsthand from the first 4 years, and secondhand for the next 8.

So you're saying that you are NOT included in the firsthand group. To me, that's the kind of caveat that should be admitted up front.

Dude: Many, including myself, feel that Scorcese's career went downhill after Taxi Driver.

Me: Have you seen Good Fellas?

Dude: I haven't seen any of his films since Taxi Driver.

Me: Okay then.

More like everything went UPHILL after Taxi Driver. And I can say that without having seen Hugo.

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

Why do you include yourself? How do you know?

I know firsthand from the first 4 years, and secondhand for the next 8.

So you're saying that you are NOT included in the firsthand group. To me, that's the kind of caveat that should be admitted up front.

Dude: Many, including myself, feel that Scorcese's career went downhill after Taxi Driver.

Me: Have you seen Good Fellas?

Dude: I haven't seen any of his films since Taxi Driver.

Me: Okay then.

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

Why do you include yourself? How do you know?

I know firsthand from the first 4 years, and secondhand for the next 8.

I just feel like none of this needed 12 years to tell. Like, you could have actually had this if they didn't waste so much time and spin wheels for years.

So, I don't disagree fundamentally. I feel like a bunch of it was just that they didn't actually know where anything was going when they started, and it took them too long to figure out. The seasons were hit or miss as far as story progression, but some of the best seasons didn't so much advance the story, but were absolutely essential for providing characterization (Season of the Haunted really sticks out here for me). Without those seasons and that characterizations, there isn't even really story, just a series of events that happens.

It was definitely a mess throughout the years, but looking back I think I can call it a success in story telling, even accounting for all the low points.

I didn't realize "The Fate Saga" was apparently the next over-arching narrative after "The Light & Dark Saga". Did I just not get the memo, or did Bungie not explain it well enough? After The Final Shape it was said that they were just going to to Episodes or something like that.

I just think it wasn't communicated very well. Episodes was just a different way of doing Seasons, I think. It was always The Fate Saga once they started talking about Edge of Fate, I thought, but I wasn't paying super close attention at the time.

I'm with you, though--I think the Fate stuff is fascinating. I'm working through Edge of Fate now, but I played Renegades when it came out and really enjoyed it.

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

Why do you include yourself? How do you know?

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

Fair enough. The "10 years" took priority over "story/lore"

BUT...

They achieved their goal. And everyone (Bungie, Sony, Gamers) then stopped after Final shape, looking back and forth at everyone thinking "...ok now what?"

And this is where I'm curious because I haven't followed the game as closely the past two years. When did "episodes" turn into "The Fate Saga"? Could another 10 years have been plotted out but it's too little too late? Or was "The Fate Saga" always been the plan and I just missed it.

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful.

I think that is a point of contention. Many, including myself, would not agree that the storytelling in the Destiny games has been up to par. The game actually lasting for ten years doesn't really say anything about the quality of storytelling in that time. There have been highs and lows in the storytelling, but more lows than highs.

I just feel like none of this needed 12 years to tell. Like, you could have actually had this if they didn't waste so much time and spin wheels for years.

*Rolls eyes and throws hands in the air*

Well......yeah!! You don't need over 100 Final Fantasy games either. And the entire Last of Us series could be one game too.

C'mon man, they set out with an ambitious goal of having a game last for 10 years. And they did it. From the beginning the goal was announced and at the end the goal was met. And then it's been 2 years of John Travolta confusedly looking back and forth.

My point is, Light and Dark had it's highs and lows, but as a whole, it was extremely ambitious and successful. Could Fate Saga have done the same thing?

Sorry, I forgot how to do spoiler html below, but...(it's not much of a spoiler fwiw)

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I didn't realize "The Fate Saga" was apparently the next over-arching narrative after "The Light & Dark Saga". Did I just not get the memo, or did Bungie not explain it well enough? After The Final Shape it was said that they were just going to to Episodes or something like that.

After the lore drops from this last update, and the cut scene with the (apparent) Winnower talking to us,....yeah, it definitely seems like a whole 'nother saga of content could have been developed. The lore of The Nine is awesome and could totally play out!!

Reaaaaaaallllly bummed if this all just ends.

I just feel like none of this needed 12 years to tell. Like, you could have actually had this if they didn't waste so much time and spin wheels for years.

---------

I didn't realize "The Fate Saga" was apparently the next over-arching narrative after "The Light & Dark Saga". Did I just not get the memo, or did Bungie not explain it well enough? After The Final Shape it was said that they were just going to to Episodes or something like that.

After the lore drops from this last update, and the cut scene with the (apparent) Winnower talking to us,....yeah, it definitely seems like a whole 'nother saga of content could have been developed. The lore of The Nine is awesome and could totally play out!!

Reaaaaaaallllly bummed if this all just ends.

I also started going through the Edge of Fate stuff properly. The matter spark mechanic sucks ass, but the campaign itself has been fun so far, and it's actually really interesting. It's even more of a bummer now to know we'll not get this story in full, because I think the Nine are vastly more interesting than most of the stuff that's been in Destiny prior to this point.

It's just cool to be having fun in Destiny again, honestly. I still can't get used to whatever they did to power weapons, though. They all feel awful. Not a single one I've found can even come close to touching the damage of my throwing hammer with Wormgods.

How? Doesn’t the post master get overwritten when new stuff goes there? You must be meticulous about managing new drops.

Yep, it was a source of constant annoyance. One entirely of my own making, but I always found vault cleaning to be like pulling teeth.

I just used DIM to dump all my postmaster stuff into the new huge vault. This is probably the first time I've ever had an empty postmaster since the beginning of the game. Some of the stuff I had in there was probably 5-6 years old.

Open a package from six years ago and get an amazing weapon.

Sunsetted.

Mfw

I know it would have been basically impossible, but I really wish they could have added the entire back content vault back into the game. I'd love to see a Distortioned Escalation Protocol, and I really wish I could run through Red War again. It's the only thing that feels like its missing from the end of life update.

Agreed. Another feature I was mentioning to folks last night is I wish they had changed the setting so raid checkpoints didn't clear from week to week. I plan to continue raiding, but it might be less frequent and we'll all be out of practice relative to now. Spending a month relearning Wrath of the Machine would be fun, for instance.

Really enjoyed SRL last night, even though I was usually last.

My son was in heaven with all the cosmetics. It was fun skimming through all the emote and finisher engrams. We've barely scratched the surface but there have already been multiple "where's this been the whole time?" moments.