Also, I have more fun in that hallway than most CoE matches. The trick is to combo Supers. A Voidwalker and a Striker can make so many orbs it's not even fair.

With the new subclasses, a Nightstalker can make it even breezier.

Yeah, it's not bad with Nightstalker. I think most players' hate for it is residual from their first experience there (I know mine is), rather than from their actual experience nowadays.

With the new subclasses, a Nightstalker can make it even breezier.

I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded.

Why do PlayStation players hate this strike in particular? I remember hearing things like this back when it was still exclusive, but then when it did come to XBox, I couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. It seems fairly similar to other strikes to me, as far as length/challenge level.

I thought perhaps the speedrunners hated it because you actually have to do the fight in the big bowl area to progress, but Undying Mind is hardly the only strike which does that. Archon Priest, Devil's Lair, Dust Palace all have similar stuff.

There's a hallway / stair climb that is just 20 minutes of constantly respawning vex yellow bar minotaurs. If you get lucky and get the Taken version, you can just snipe the one yellow wizard and you're clear for like 2 minutes of running up to the next checkpoint, but the vex version is brutal. It can be fun, but it's always frustrating as there are just so many (SO MANY) damn enemies. It was especially brutal as a gunslinger before the latest patch because three shots from my golden gun would only pop the shields and do about 2/3 damage to a single one of the 6 approaching minotaurs. It's not nearly so bad now, and I have a reasonable chance to generate orbs for people.

I'm not sure how they can argue that the 1 month delay in The Division is somehow comparable to the 1 YEAR delay in Destiny.

Because in Destiny, it's a handful of exclusive content that doesn't alter the game (except when Hawkmoon WAS the entire Meta of 2/3rds of Year One).

In the Division, it's a huge piece of endgame content to the game, and PS4 players are 100% locked out. Would you be okay if The Taken King had been a month-long PS4 exclusive, if it meant no Year 2 exclusive content?

This can never be said by a Bungie employee, but I have yet to see Playstation exclusive Destiny content that lived up to the hype (and sometimes I've wondered if that was deliberate). I've played on both platforms from the start, and I've never felt like my Xbox experience was "diminished" in any way. The most substantive exclusives have been the strikes, and I never thought, man, I really want to play Undying Mind. I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded. I like the strike but never felt it was important to events in the story, like, say, Omnigul.

Agree/disagree. The "bonus" strikes have all been kinda meh, but some of the items like Hawkmoon literally helped define the pvp meta. You may not have "missed" it per se on the xbox, but it changed the overall game experience in a substantive way.

Well, that's cool for you, but I never got one until long after it had been nerfed (it may have even been year two). Is an exclusive so wonderful (or so unfair or shittier to left-out players on the other platform) if there's a fair chance that you, as a player on the "best" platform, won't even get it? I've long thought the exclusives are not really substantial and little more than grist for platform hype that helped defer the cost of marketing.

Whether or not you got one (and I'm truly sorry to hear that you didn't), it still helped to define the meta of PvP as enough other people had it to shift gameplay to knowing when and where it was safe to engage a hawkmoon user. I mean, you don't need to have nukes to know that you don't mess with a state that does have them, right? The game shifted. I wouldn't say it was "wonderful" at all, but it was certainly impactful in a way that made the pvp experience on PS4 different, fundamentally, from that on Xbone. To be honest, I can't even say if that difference was for better or worse for either platform, or just simply different without actually improving the play experience on either one. Even so, the fact that the exclusive item was so significant in the overall experience of pvp means that it was an exclusive item of substance. Was it intended to have that effect? Probably not, but have that effect it did.

Does the fact that the gun had a noticeable effect mean it wasn't pure marketing grist? No, not really. The conversation around that was probably along the lines of, "Which exotic did you make that we can have as exclusive? How about this hand cannon, "The Hawkmoon?" Everyone will be using Thorn anyway."

Frankly, all of the "special" Destiny content has been underwhelming grist. The pre-order exclusives uniformly suck (which is why I'm not in the least excited about a black Gjallerhorn - what a shit gimmick) and the exclusive content is (aside from the exotics) so rarely in rotation as to be practically non existent. I suppose the pvp map comes up a fair amount, but with so many other pvp maps in the game and with none of them bringing a special or unique pvp experience other than giving you a different venue in which to murder people, you're really not going to feel its absence.

But even in the face of that grist, I think it's way shittier to hold back this additional content from a released product for a year than it is to just not release an xpac for a month.

I'm not sure how they can argue that the 1 month delay in The Division is somehow comparable to the 1 YEAR delay in Destiny.

Because in Destiny, it's a handful of exclusive content that doesn't alter the game (except when Hawkmoon WAS the entire Meta of 2/3rds of Year One).

In the Division, it's a huge piece of endgame content to the game, and PS4 players are 100% locked out. Would you be okay if The Taken King had been a month-long PS4 exclusive, if it meant no Year 2 exclusive content?

This can never be said by a Bungie employee, but I have yet to see Playstation exclusive Destiny content that lived up to the hype (and sometimes I've wondered if that was deliberate). I've played on both platforms from the start, and I've never felt like my Xbox experience was "diminished" in any way. The most substantive exclusives have been the strikes, and I never thought, man, I really want to play Undying Mind. I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded. I like the strike but never felt it was important to events in the story, like, say, Omnigul.

Agree/disagree. The "bonus" strikes have all been kinda meh, but some of the items like Hawkmoon literally helped define the pvp meta. You may not have "missed" it per se on the xbox, but it changed the overall game experience in a substantive way.

Well, that's cool for you, but I never got one until long after it had been nerfed (it may have even been year two). Is an exclusive so wonderful (or so unfair or shittier to left-out players on the other platform) if there's a fair chance that you, as a player on the "best" platform, won't even get it? I've long thought the exclusives are not really substantial and little more than grist for platform hype that helped defer the cost of marketing.

It's always been one of the more fun strikes (The orbs! The dynamic boss fight!), but people hated that the long Hallway fight granted you no glimmer, especially since you were fighting tons of Majors. These people are dumb. Fun is fun, glimmer or not.

Interesting, thanks for the clarification. That does make sense, although I have to agree it's dumb (I have so many glimmer items stashed in the vault that I never think about farming it). And that hallway might be the best spot in the game for making orbs/chaining supers. I love running it with a coordinated fireteam.

I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded.

Why do PlayStation players hate this strike in particular? I remember hearing things like this back when it was still exclusive, but then when it did come to XBox, I couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. It seems fairly similar to other strikes to me, as far as length/challenge level.

I thought perhaps the speedrunners hated it because you actually have to do the fight in the big bowl area to progress, but Undying Mind is hardly the only strike which does that. Archon Priest, Devil's Lair, Dust Palace all have similar stuff.

It's always been one of the more fun strikes (The orbs! The dynamic boss fight!), but people hated that the long Hallway fight granted you no glimmer, especially since you were fighting tons of Majors. These people are dumb. Fun is fun, glimmer or not.

The also-Vex-themed Echo chamber hasn't gotten similar hate, and I imagine that's because glimmer doesn't matter much anymore, and you can speedrun the whole thing in under five minutes For the Imago Loop (and Theosyion Vibrissae Gauntlets).

I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded.

Why do PlayStation players hate this strike in particular? I remember hearing things like this back when it was still exclusive, but then when it did come to XBox, I couldn't figure out what was wrong with it. It seems fairly similar to other strikes to me, as far as length/challenge level.

I thought perhaps the speedrunners hated it because you actually have to do the fight in the big bowl area to progress, but Undying Mind is hardly the only strike which does that. Archon Priest, Devil's Lair, Dust Palace all have similar stuff.

I'm not sure how they can argue that the 1 month delay in The Division is somehow comparable to the 1 YEAR delay in Destiny.

Because in Destiny, it's a handful of exclusive content that doesn't alter the game (except when Hawkmoon WAS the entire Meta of 2/3rds of Year One).

In the Division, it's a huge piece of endgame content to the game, and PS4 players are 100% locked out. Would you be okay if The Taken King had been a month-long PS4 exclusive, if it meant no Year 2 exclusive content?

This can never be said by a Bungie employee, but I have yet to see Playstation exclusive Destiny content that lived up to the hype (and sometimes I've wondered if that was deliberate). I've played on both platforms from the start, and I've never felt like my Xbox experience was "diminished" in any way. The most substantive exclusives have been the strikes, and I never thought, man, I really want to play Undying Mind. I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded. I like the strike but never felt it was important to events in the story, like, say, Omnigul.

Agree/disagree. The "bonus" strikes have all been kinda meh, but some of the items like Hawkmoon literally helped define the pvp meta. You may not have "missed" it per se on the xbox, but it changed the overall game experience in a substantive way.

I'm not sure how they can argue that the 1 month delay in The Division is somehow comparable to the 1 YEAR delay in Destiny.

Because in Destiny, it's a handful of exclusive content that doesn't alter the game (except when Hawkmoon WAS the entire Meta of 2/3rds of Year One).

In the Division, it's a huge piece of endgame content to the game, and PS4 players are 100% locked out. Would you be okay if The Taken King had been a month-long PS4 exclusive, if it meant no Year 2 exclusive content?

This can never be said by a Bungie employee, but I have yet to see Playstation exclusive Destiny content that lived up to the hype (and sometimes I've wondered if that was deliberate). I've played on both platforms from the start, and I've never felt like my Xbox experience was "diminished" in any way. The most substantive exclusives have been the strikes, and I never thought, man, I really want to play Undying Mind. I always had trouble finding randos who wouldn't quit when Undying Mind loaded. I like the strike but never felt it was important to events in the story, like, say, Omnigul.

Hate to brake it to you, but you've clearly died and gotten stuck in pergatory. ;)

That explains so much of my current life lol

One month is bad, especially with this genre of game, but at least the community is segregated for a lot less time. The feeling of second class consumer is much less for this kind of deal for me at least. One month makes me think poorly of the platform holder, Xbox in this case. One year makes me think poorly of Bungie because they allowed such a long period of separation to exist.

The moment EA lets that contract end, any number of companies (well, probably just 2K) will throw whatever they can at the NFL to get that license. Considering how much revenue Madden generates, that would be an awful idea.

The only one at fault here is the NFL for putting their exclusive rights up for sale in the first place.

Oh yeah, EA and the NFL have certainly conspired to create a segment of the video game market where it's impossible to compete. They're both to blame, but because the NFL has special permissions regarding antitrust, nothing can be done about it.

I'm not sure how they can argue that the 1 month delay in The Division is somehow comparable to the 1 YEAR delay in Destiny.

Because in Destiny, it's a handful of exclusive content that doesn't alter the game (except when Hawkmoon WAS the entire Meta of 2/3rds of Year One).

In the Division, it's a huge piece of endgame content to the game, and PS4 players are 100% locked out. Would you be okay if The Taken King had been a month-long PS4 exclusive, if it meant no Year 2 exclusive content?

I thought for a while about this, and I think the answer is yes. Waiting another month for a reason to play a game you're presently not playing, and then getting the whole experience is something I'd very much prefer to getting a diminished experience for a year, and then getting the full experience when (a) none of it is really fresh and new anymore and (b) some other diminished experience is being released at the same time.

After that month of exclusivity, both PS4 and Xbox will have the same Division. But after a year of Destiny, Xbone still won't have the same game as PS4 because some new expansion with an equally shitty exclusivity period will be attached.

Another comparison is the price point: If I spend $20 for an expansion of the division in June, that's really the same as spending $20 for that expansion in July. But for Destiny it's spend $40 now and get 90% of it, and then - in a YEAR - you get the last 10%. That's shitty. There's a built in delay to getting what you paid for. Now, if the Division said you had to buy the xpac now and then wait a month after purchasing before you could play it, that would be way shittier, but that's not the case.

To be clear, neither gives me a "good" feeling, I just find the Destiny exclusivity shittier than the division one.